A.I. Artificial Intelligence (2001) - 2015 3CD set from La-La Land Records

[Jamie Dutton 7,675]

They never seem to come alive. Not compared to something like this:

For many of us, this is what established the signature Williams sound. Not just the music and the performance, but the recording, man. Williams continued to do big scores into the 2000s including the Star Wars Prequels with the LSO and employing modern technology, but they never achieved this sound.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,498]

Not really. The recording of SW sounds pretty unique. And very different from his later LSO works.

I was actually very disappointed by it when I first heard it.

[Code 000. Destruct. 0. 4,260]

They never seem to come alive. Not compared to something like this:

For many of us, this is what established the signature Williams sound. Not just the music and the performance, but the recording, man. Williams continued to do big scores into the 2000s including the Star Wars Prequels with the LSO and employing modern technology, but they never achieved this sound.

But that's what we've been discussing. What scores have needed to achieve that kind of sound? Some music sounds good in one setting, and other music sounds good in a different setting. The way that score was composed lent itself to that particular sort of recording.

Would you have every Williams score share the same exact sonic profile?

[Jay 40,400]

The Phantom Menace: Ultimate Edition has some of the best sound quality I've ever heard. I want all the Star Wars scores to sound that good

[Not Mr. Big 4,753]

I love the sound of Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone. In my opinion, it's finds the perfect mix between precision and reverb. The third comes close while the second feels a little too "soupy".

[Jay 40,400]

I think Harry Potter 2 is one of the best sounding scores I own!

~

Its $34.98

http://filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=110035&forumID=1

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,498]

I think Harry Potter 2 is one of the best sounding scores I own!

]

And its the one where JW didn't supervise the recording off.

[A24 4,663]

The Phantom Menace: Ultimate Edition has some of the best sound quality I've ever heard. I want all the Star Wars scores to sound that good

In fact, I think there is money to be made with that. The complete OT, re-recorded and conducted by Williams, in either Abbey Road Studios or Skywalker Ranch.

(if it's Abbey Road, put the microphones a bit closer to the orchestra like with The Skywalker Symphony, please)

Alexandre

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,498]

Yuck!

[crocodile 8,755]

At least it's not a wine cellar, Inchon style!

Karol

[A24 4,663]

I like detail. Put the microphones too far and it sounds as if you're listening to music while being outside the room. 'Distant miking' picks up too much reflections of the room and not so much the sound and detail of the instruments themselves. It's why I hate most classical piano/guitar recordings.

[crocodile 8,755]

I like when it sounds appropriate to the content.

Karol

[A24 4,663]

There is no appropriate, only preference. That's why almost every recording of the same piece is recorded with a different approach. Deutsche Grammophon has different phases. They have periods where everything sounds close miked and they have periods where it's like you're sitting in the back of the theatre.

[crocodile 8,755]

I prefer variety then.

Karol

[Lady Dimitrescu 9,132]

I like detail. Put the microphones too far and it sounds as if you're listening to music while being outside the room. 'Distant miking' picks up too much reflections of the room and not so much the sound and detail of the instruments themselves. It's why I hate most classical piano/guitar recordings.

And yet you love the noisy consumer grade camera microphones that some low tech ASMR artists use. Make up your mind!

[A24 4,663]

Two different things.

[filmmusic 2,363]

I was wondering, where will you buy this?

Every single purchase of a 2cd (or more) set that I did directly from La-laland came to me with broken case!

So, I'm thinking of ordering from SAE.

But I don't remember if the shipping is significantly higher than that of La-laland.

I can't take any chances though. It will be difficult I think to substitute that 3 cd case.

[Lady Dimitrescu 9,132]

Two different things.

Yeah right!

[A24 4,663]

You don't understand the difference between an ASMR video and a classical piano recording? Weird!

[Lady Dimitrescu 9,132]

Both demand high quality audio.

[Marian Schedenig 9,403]

In your opinion, when did Williams recordings get better again? I mean, all his 2010s scores sound fantastic

POA, as others have said. That one sounds great, in fact, and came completely unexpected at the time. Since then, Murphy's Williams output has been slightly uneven, but mostly very fine.

[crocodile 8,755]

The Terminal had good sound.

Karol

[thx99 1,916]

A.I. was recorded by Shawn Murphy in 2001 at 48 khz / 24 bit.

Thanks for the info, Jay! I have no reason to doubt its accuracy.

Frankly the DVD-A just sounds like a rush job made in the early days of the medium. Shame, but I'm sure it wasn't the only DVD-A to be a fake upsample from a 16/44.1 album master!

It's sure looking like the A.I. DVD-A was just a marketing scam essentially, except for the 5.1 mix which is unique to the release.

A few other technical bits we haven't really touched on related to "high-resolution" audio are the issues of (1) humans' ability to even perceive frequencies above the theoretical high end of hearing (20 kHz), and (2) the limitations of recording venues, audio cabling/hardware/circuitry, etc. truly achieving ~144 dB of dynamic range, the theoretical range for a 24-bit recording. But these are topics for another day, in another forum.

[karelm 3,128]

They never seem to come alive. Not compared to something like this:

For many of us, this is what established the signature Williams sound. Not just the music and the performance, but the recording, man. Williams continued to do big scores into the 2000s including the Star Wars Prequels with the LSO and employing modern technology, but they never achieved this sound.

I agree with you. There is something so pleasurable about the LP sounds that those who grew up with it will fondly recall. That sound was so great and the stars aligned just right to produce this masterpiece. And lightning did strike twice in with Empire too.

[Sharkissimo 1,974]

I realise I'm behind the conversation, but...

They don't sound bad in the 2010s, but they don't sound great either. The standard I hold all Williams scores to: classic LSO recordings (Star Wars Trilogy may be problematic since 1997, but that's the fault of those remasters/remixes--listen to the older releases), E.T. and Temple of Doom. These are definitive unmatched recordings.

I find the original SW (and to some extent TOD) a little bit too dry, but CE3K (who did that?), ROTLA, ROTJ and E.T. are the pinnacles of Williams recordings as far as I'm concerned. They're punchy, but don't sound dated or bone-dry either. The bass response in particular is outstanding. I used to think there was a bass synth in the open forest cue from E.T. for a while and until I saw the score, and realised it was just warmly captured contrabasses.

[A24 4,663]

E.T. doesn't sound natural (very early digital recording), neither does the original Close Encounters. The SE does sound a lot better. Need to check the later E.T. releases on CD. I believe they are 'corrected'.

[Sharkissimo 1,974]

What's wrong with it not sounding 'natural'?

[A24 4,663]

Nothing ... when you are The Beatles.

[Marian Schedenig 9,403]

E.T. doesn't sound natural (very early digital recording), neither does the original Close Encounters. The SE does sound a lot better. Need to check the later E.T. releases on CD. I believe they are 'corrected'.

Botnick's original E.T. album sounds great. The first extended release sounds fine, the anniversary release has been murdered by Murphy.

[Sharkissimo 1,974]

Nothing ... when you are The Beatles.

So a symphony orchestra has to sound like it's in Alex Cremers's living room?

Great.

[A24 4,663]

E.T. doesn't sound natural (very early digital recording), neither does the original Close Encounters. The SE does sound a lot better. Need to check the later E.T. releases on CD. I believe they are 'corrected'.

Botnick's original E.T. album sounds great. The first extended release sounds fine, the anniversary release has been murdered by Murphy.

I think the metal sharpness (perceived by many as 'clarity' but is actually unintentional 'distortion' which was introduced by early digital technology) has been solved for the later extended and anniversary releases. They fed the console's signal simultaneously to a digital and an analogue two-track. It's quite possible that later releases used the analogue stereo track. The absence of distortion in those later releases could be experienced as a 'shortage'.

Nothing ... when you are The Beatles.

So a symphony orchestra has to sound like it's in Alex Cremers's living room?

Great.

Grow up.

Alexandre

[Sharkissimo 1,974]

Ok, I'll be mature. Some questions, no snarkiness:

1. Would the early digital distortion you speak of be anti-aliasing?

2. The analogue two track... that would be after the 24 tracks were bounced down, right?

3. What digital recorder and sampling rate do you reckon Botnik used on the original?

4. What mixing console was used? The SL4000?

5. Why does CE3K sound the way it does? That wasn't digital, or was it?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,498]

CE3K was analog

[Marian Schedenig 9,403]

I think the metal sharpness (perceived by many as 'clarity' but is actually unintentional 'distortion' which was introduced by early digital technology) has been solved for the later extended and anniversary releases. They fed the console's signal simultaneously to a digital and an analogue two-track. It's quite possible that later releases used the analogue stereo track. The absence of distortion in those later releases could be experienced as a 'shortage'.

The original E.T. CD says it's AAD.

And I don't know about sharpness, but listen to the full sound of the string rumblings in Abandoned and Pursued. None of the later releases have that.

[Sharkissimo 1,974]

I think the metal sharpness (perceived by many as 'clarity' but is actually unintentional 'distortion' which was introduced by early digital technology) has been solved for the later extended and anniversary releases. They fed the console's signal simultaneously to a digital and an analogue two-track. It's quite possible that later releases used the analogue stereo track. The absence of distortion in those later releases could be experienced as a 'shortage'.

The original E.T. CD says it's AAD.

That makes more since, since there's an article on THE PATRIOT somewhere with Williams's talking about he and Murphy prefer the warmth of analogue to digital.

[phbart 640]

The screens of the 1990 CE3K CD vs the 2005 DVD-A. Bare in mind that the DVD-A, even at glorious 192kHz/24bit, was sourced from the 1977 album master.

1990 CD

Spectral View:http://postimg.org/image/mlnp4efn9/Statistics:http://postimg.org/image/4llptajkh/

2005 DVD-A

Spectral View:http://postimg.org/image/lshraputt/Statistics:http://postimg.org/image/5qcluiv4t/

If you all like, I can post E.T. images of every digital format I have: 1991 CD, 1996 expanded CD, 2002 20th anniversary CD and SACD (a kind soul from overseas sent me 88.2kHz/24bit PCM conversion of both the 2.0 and 5.1 channels from the SACD done with a Playstation 3 hack).

[Luke Skywalker 2,028]

35 dollars? And With LLL charging postage for each cd... and huge fees for spain shipping...it is going to cost be a kidney...

Is SAE cheaper, postage wise?

[Incanus 5,831]

35 dollars? And With LLL charging postage for each cd... and huge fees for spain shipping...it is going to cost be a kidney...

Is SAE cheaper, postage wise?

I doubt it. The prices are about the same but if I remember correctly SAE too has higher shipping costs for certain countries.

LL-Land: ALL OTHER COUNTRIES: $10.00 for the first CD and $2.50 for each additional CD. – (don’t forget to add $2.50 for each disc in multiple CD sets)

All orders will be shipped Air Mail via the United States Postal Service

SAE: ALL OTHER COUNTRIES: $10.00 for first disc and $2.50 for each additional disc. Don't forget to add $2.50 for each disc in multiple CD sets. All orders are sent USPS Air Mail.

[filmmusic 2,363]

35 dollars? And With LLL charging postage for each cd... and huge fees for spain shipping...it is going to cost be a kidney...

Is SAE cheaper, postage wise?

I doubt it. The prices are about the same but if I remember correctly SAE too has higher shipping costs for certain countries.

LL-Land: ALL OTHER COUNTRIES: $10.00 for the first CD and $2.50 for each additional CD. – (don’t forget to add $2.50 for each disc in multiple CD sets)

All orders will be shipped Air Mail via the United States Postal Service

SAE: ALL OTHER COUNTRIES: $10.00 for first disc and $2.50 for each additional disc. Don't forget to add $2.50 for each disc in multiple CD sets. All orders are sent USPS Air Mail.

So, it's exactly the same then as you say it.

$15 for the A.I. set from both shops, right?

that's approx. $50 in total.

[Jay 40,400]

The set will not only be sold through LLL or SAE; You'll also be able to get it at these places, among probably others as well:

http://www.moviemusic.com

http://www.intrada.com

http://www.musicbox-records.com/en/

So I'd recommend looking up their international shipping rates as well. With Music Box Records being European based, they might be you guys' best bet.

[Incanus 5,831]

The set will not only be sold through LLL or SAE: You'll also be able to get it at these places, among probably others as well:

http://www.moviemusic.com

http://www.intrada.com

http://www.musicbox-records.com/en/

So I'd recommend looking up their international shipping rates as well. With Music Box Records being Europepean based, they might be you guys' best bet.

For European retailers it depends on the price of the actual set whether it will be cheaper to order from them or abroad.

[filmmusic 2,363]

Does anyone know if at musicbox records a 3CD set counts as 3 CD items, or 1 CD?

it doesn't say.

http://www.musicbox-records.com/en/content/1-delivery

For European retailers it depends on the price of the actual set whether it will be cheaper to order from them or abroad.

Yeah, you got a point.

I see for example the Return to Oz set is at $29.95 at SAE (approx. 27,2 euros according to xe.com), but it's at 32.95 euros at music box!!!

So, even if the shipping is lower, the price of the cd makes up for the loss.

In fact it may be cheaper to buy from US (to those of us in Europe)

[crumbs 15,132]

What's usually the best store for Australian buyers? UK or US based?

[Jay 40,400]

To guage how much this new set will cost at various other retailers, with shipping included, you can order one of these two items and get to the final part of the shopping cart before canceling out

Various - Star Trek TNG Vol 1

Ira Newborn - The Naked Gun Trilogy

Those are both LLL 3CD sets that retails for $34.98, so everything should be the same.

[Koray Savas 2,254]

That extra $2.50 for each additional disc is just plain extortion.

[filmmusic 2,363]

To guage how much this new set will cost at various other retailers, with shipping included, you can order one of these two items and get to the final part of the shopping cart before canceling out

Various - Star Trek TNG Vol 1

Ira Newborn - The Naked Gun Trilogy

Those are both LLL 3CD sets that retails for $34.98, so everything should be the same.

Yes, it's $49.95 at SAE for me but maybe there is an extra "Williams" charge!

[Jay 40,400]

OK, I just tried something. I went to all 5 retailers that I know will be selling it, and used The Naked Gun trilogy (a 3CD LLL set that retails for $35 just like AI will) using first my home address, then a random address I picked in the UK. Here are the final prices:

US address:

LLL: $40.98 ($34.98 + $6.00)

SAE: $41.20 ($34.95 + $6.25)

MM: $37.98 ($34.99 + $2.99) - don't forget at MM, if your order includes at least 3 new titles, shipping is $1!

Intrada: $40.54 ($34.99 + $5.55)

MBR: 50,25 € [~$54.85 USD] (39,95 € + 10,30 €)

UK address:

LLL: $49.98 ($34.98 + $15.00)

SAE: $49.95 ($34.95 + $15.00)

MM: $49.98 ($34.99 + $14.99)

Intrada: $52.99 ($34.99 + $18.00)

MBR: 48,65 € [~$53.09 USD] (39,95 € + 8,70 €)

So basically, MovieMusic.com wins no matter where you live!

[Luke Skywalker 2,028]

OK, I just tried something. I went to all 5 retailers that I know will be selling it, and used The Naked Gun trilogy (a 3CD LLL set that retails for $35 just like AI will) using first my home address, then a random address I picked in the UK. Here are the final prices:

US address:

LLL: $40.98 ($34.98 + $6.00)

SAE: $41.20 ($34.95 + $6.25)

MM: $37.98 ($34.99 + $2.99) - don't forget at MM, if your order includes at least 3 titles, shipping is free!

Intrada: $40.54 ($34.99 + $5.55)

MBR: 50,25 € [~$54.85 USD] (39,95 € + 10,30 €)

UK address:

LLL: $49.98 ($34.98 + $15.00)

SAE: $49.95 ($34.95 + $15.00)

MM: $49.98 ($34.99 + $14.99)

Intrada: $52.99 ($34.99 + $18.00)

MBR: 48,65 € [~$53.09 USD] (39,95 € + 8,70 €)

So basically, MovieMusic.com wins no matter where you live!

SAE for the uk is an amazing 3 cent cheaper

I'll order from LLL, safer to order from the retail...even if the case arrives damaged...

My god... 50$. It better contain ALL the music.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,498]

The weak Euro doesn't help

[Luke Skywalker 2,028]

yep